Building Trust: How Consistency, Embodiment, and Surrender Shape Self-Trust and Relationships

Welcome back to The Circle, the podcast where we go all in on men's work, embodiment practices, and personal growth from our queer perspective. If you're enjoying the show, please be sure to share your favorite episode, leave us a review, and subscribe. If you have a question about anything you've heard us talk about, please send us a message. We'd love to hear from you. And now onto the show.

Today, we're exploring one of the most foundational and complex aspects of personal growth, trust. What allows us to trust ourselves? What needs to be in place for us to trust others? And how do we balance discernment with vulnerability in a world where trust can be both a gift and risk? And beyond all that, what does it mean to trust in something bigger than ourselves?

Tim, are you ready to go all in? I'm ready. Alright. Let's do this. So you opened the sharing circle this week with a journal prompt that was a pretty powerful reflective inquiry for for me.

It was with whom or what do you have the greatest trust? And this prompt really took me inside. I I was took me a couple minutes to really wrestle with it, navigate with it, and I ultimately came down to that I trust myself the most and that unveiled a couple trust issues that I have externally. And so I'm curious, from your perspective, what factors contribute to our ability to trust ourselves, and what elements are essential to trust others?

I think the process of building self trust starts with our capacity to uphold the commitments we make to ourselves. And so I think that we live in a world where it is frequent or even even sometimes, celebrated that a person will sacrifice aspects of themselves in service to something else. Right? And I think that that there are moments when that is absolutely necessary. I I'm thinking about parents, for example, and sometimes you have to abandon something you wanted to do because your kids need you, your family needs you, or something like that.

But so those are, like, exceptions. But then there's this other idea of, oh, like, the more I give of myself, the better person I am, how generous I am, or, you know, whatever. And there isn't really built in this importance of, like, well, how do we value taking care of ourselves in the same way that we would value taking care of someone else? Right? And so that, I think, is one really important component of building trust is I I tell myself what I need or what my goals are or what, you know, what it is I'm wanting to create.

And then I stick to the plan in as in the greatest amount of integrity that is possible.

Yeah. Sounds like, building consistency. Right? So the consistency of showing up for myself has helped me to trust myself more. So I've shared this on the podcast that I had a deep mistrust for my body growing up.

And what I've learned over the last couple of years of becoming more physically active and prioritizing my physical health has been that, where it's like, oh, if I'm more consistent in my physical practices, I start to learn trust in my abilities. And so what I'm hearing is consistency.

I think consistency is a really important factor for most things. You know, if we wanna get good at something, we have to we have to practice it generally over and over. So you think, oh, I wanna go to the I wanna get in great shape. You can't just do one workout. If I wanna learn a skill like the piano, you can't just get one lesson, and then expect to be where you wanna be.

And the same is true for trust, then it's like, oh, if I wanna start to develop trust in myself, if I wanna if I wanna understand the relationship I'm having with myself and begin to trust that relationship, then I have to come back to it over and over and over again. And I think that's, a practice that we all would benefit from and also a practice that we don't talk about much, I think, in our in our culture, which is why men's workspaces are are good because then we can talk about that. Oh, when when did I when did I fail to uphold this commitment? And then without without judgment or, like, punishment, how do I bring myself back into integrity? And then that process, that conversation is a trust building conversation.

So it's not about perfection. Perfection. It's about a willingness to continue, and the consistency is a

part of that. Right. Because perfection will keep me from taking action or trying something. And then how am I gonna create consistency if I'm unwilling or afraid to try? And so with consistency, I also start to think of, like, safety.

Right? Like, when I am consistent in something, I can rest a little bit more into it. Mhmm. If somebody in my life is consistent, I can rest with them a little bit more. I start to feel a little bit more grounded.

I start to feel a little safer, a little bit more stable. When there's inconsistency, there's uncertainty.

Well, because consistency feels like observable evidence. Oh, this person consistently shows up in this way. It's easier then for me to trust them to be able to continue to show up in that way. And it's actually not always good or bad. So we've had this where, you know, I had a family member who had a had a drinking problem, and so they were very consistent in some of the ways that they would show up.

But then but then that was like, I'm like, I see your consistency. I know how you're gonna show up. I get to now, set my own expectations and boundaries around if that works for me. So it can be good or bad, but the consistency is an indication.

And and in that case, maybe the there's an opportunity to develop self trust. Oh, I recognize that that person or thing isn't right for me because they've demonstrated through their consistency something that I can now trust myself to say, don't want a part of that. And so it's almost like an inverse. Like, I don't trust them, but I trust myself. I trust my boundaries that I'm gonna put in place based off of that consistent behavior I'm seeing.

Yeah. Yeah. Think the development of self trust is the tool that helps you understand what you're gonna allow yourself to do or the situations you're gonna put yourself in. You know, when, one way of building self trust is this felt sense practice, this embodiment practice where, you know, we do this in the sharing circle. There's lots of different ways to do it and lots of different practices, but where you scan through the physical body and you start looking for sensation.

And then, you know, in some of the practices, then you'll ask, is there an emotion connected to that? But the more we are capable of listening to our body and communicating with our body in the language in which it communicates, which is the language of sensation, the more we can get those messages and then the more we can practice trusting those messages. So, when we think about the example we just gave and, you know, potentially being around a person who is consistently showing up in a way that we don't love, one thing we could do is check-in. Well, how do I feel after an interaction with that person? How do I feel after spending time with them or giving them some of my energy or whatever?

And then trusting, oh, I consistently feel at at like, a sense of unease or drained or whatever the thing is. And that then is information for us too. If I always feel drained with you, then what is it I need to look at, and what is it I might need to change?

Maybe a sense of irregularity as well. Like like, if there is that inconsistency and my nervous system isn't allowed to regulate, if I'm feeling a little spiked around somebody or even myself. So I'm going to bring this back to myself again because the original question was around, and then the original sharing prompt was around, what do you trust the most? And my development has been, like, trusting myself. And for the longest time, why I didn't trust myself is because I did not feel safe in my own body.

Like, I myself could not regulate my own nervous system. I myself could not exist inside of this body feeling 100% safe. Yeah. And that's been a lot of the work that I've been doing over the last several years between AA therapy, men's work, embodiment practices, just on the spiritual path is like, how can I learn to trust myself? How can I feel a little bit more safe in my body?

And a lot of it has been honestly like a surrender of like, oh, there are many parts of my body that I can't control. I can't control most of the bodily functions that are going on in my body. I can partially control my breath. Right? That's one thing that I can do, but most other things are involuntarily.

Yeah. And that's been a big part of, like, my trust building is that I'm like, oh, okay. I trust that my body can do this. I don't have to control it. I can have faith in it.

And I can start to rest and like, okay, I feel a little safer in my body now. And that has helped me now to start to bring that trust externally and to start recognizing where in life do I feel safe, or do I feel safe enough? Where am I regulated enough to put more trust into something?

Well, so you brought up the first prompt from sharing circle, but it had a sort of a secondary question. Do you remember what that is?

I'm gonna pull it up right now.

Oh, you're gonna pull

it up. Okay. In what or whom do you have the greatest trust? And then what is it about that person or situation that allows you to trust it?

Right. So in that question, asking people to start to identify rather than, individual details like this person or the situation. And what we what we came up with in the circle, what I heard a lot of was, oh, when when I recognize consistency, when I recognize reliability, when I recognize a steadiness or a groundedness. A commitment to values, upholding values. Yeah.

Exactly. That those were the moments when people often reported feeling able to trust. And I suspect, as you rightly said, that that's connected then to safety. It's like, I feel safe enough to trust you based on these things. And so then we start to we can use that as a tool, as a signpost.

Oh, I'm looking now for people who can be consistent, and I can start that with me. Can I be consistent with me? Can I uphold the commitments I make to myself even in the moments when I don't want to? And, again, this isn't, an all or nothing. So I used to really be the all or nothing person.

You know, I do my daily journaling and breath practice. And the the younger version of me would have been, if you missed one day, like, it's over. You've ruined it. You know? And starting again would have been, you know, terrible.

And now I'm I'm softening. Not it's not that I let myself off the hook. I still basically do it every day. But when we were on retreat, it didn't make sense for any number of reasons. And I was still doing a lot of other practice.

And I I was able to say, well, I'm I'm not. My practice is shifting right now in this moment for these reasons. And so it started to I knew I I was I felt safe in my own consistency, which allowed me then to make a subtle change in that moment. So it sounds like it was inconsistent, but but on some level to me, it wasn't. I was still consistently practicing.

It had to shift for those four days because of my leadership role and my schedule.

Yeah. And the intention was still there, And there was still an upholding of a commitment to yourself from what I'm hearing. Still an upholding of that commitment to like, I'm going to have a daily practice. That daily practice may be something different. Or even in the case of like this morning, I woke up, I slept in a little bit this morning, and I didn't do my typical hour of practices.

Oh my goodness. Radical shift. Which, I mean, my journey has been pretty incredible radical this year where I went through a moment of time where I was like, I can't have any specific consistency in my routine because it's stifling me. It's driving me nuts. And so my practices were actually a little like, I was always committed to doing something.

Mhmm.

But what they were was not consistent. And so I needed that variety in my life. Variety actually created more stability for me than consistency in a very specific thing.

Well, it sounds like the masculine feminine, the yin yang, where you had the structure of I'm going to do a practice, but then you had the flow for, well, that practice can be whatever it wants to be today as long as it's a practice. And so to me, that's a combination of these two things sort of flowing together.

Yeah. And that's what I was hearing with you with with the retreat was like, I'm still committed, I'm still upholding this and I'm still moving forward. Anyway, so going back to this morning for me was that I sat up and I was like, I feel really bad that I'm not going to do it because I am in more of an era of masculine structure where I want the consistency, the repetition of the same. And I woke up this morning and I was like, I'm not going to do it. And there was a big part of me that started to fall into old programming, was self flat flatulation?

Flagulation? Flagulation.

I think. Right? Like, I'm, like, whipping myself. I'm like, I'm useless. I'm pathetic.

Like, blah blah blah blah blah. And I was like, no. No. No. Like, you can pull yourself back, and this is what you said earlier.

I can pull myself back into integrity. I don't have to fall into that old pattern of like, oh, I messed up once. Everything is done. Burn it all down. Right?

I can I can say no? Like, yes. I'm still gonna do something, and tomorrow I'll pick it back up.

Right. I'm gonna use today as an example too because, yesterday was a big day for me, and I didn't get great sleep last night. And I woke up, and my my practice today changed where I did do my morning pages, but I didn't do my breath immediately. And I knew that there would be room for breath later. So, as you know, because we just did it right before in preparation for this recording, we did some breath practice.

It isn't typically how I do it, and it won't be my general routine. But I allowed myself some flexibility. Like, well, I it's not that I'm not gonna do it. I'm just not gonna do it in precisely the same way. So the consistency of doing it is still there even though and the of the flexibility of moving it when I need to is also there.

Yeah. Can I can I ask you a question on that? I want you to. So how is your relationship with your self trust today after that?

I've I feel I feel solid. I I knew I was gonna do it, and I was rolling with what with what was happening. Say, okay. I had a really big day yesterday, and I am feeling especially tired right now. And, oh, also, because I because I was sore.

I was like, my torso was sore. I'm like, I don't know that big breath right now is gonna be the thing that feels good anyway. So I knew when I was gonna do it. And I would have done it without you, but we we put it in the schedule. So I'm like, great.

It's gonna happen. It's just not gonna happen when it normally happens. What I'm also hearing, what I love about this is that by listening to yourself to to to say, like, yesterday was a big day.

My quality of sleep wasn't wasn't the best, and I also am experiencing some bodily things. Like, that to me is a huge example of, like, trusting self. Right? And, like and the more that we can, like, listen to ourselves, like, some

Well, and so and right. And so part of building our ability to trust ourselves for me is that felt sense. And I feel like, you know, you and I are quite different sometimes in the way that we do it. So when the way you described practice but having it be kind of whatever you want on any particular day in that little moment in your life, that sounds way too chaotic for me. Like, I like I like more more structure there.

But I do my practices the way I do my practices because of how they make me feel and how it sets me up for my day. So that could also be the measure to be like, can I can I start to get familiar with how I feel in doing something? And then if that feeling is telling me that it's of service, let that be a clue. So that's why you and I can have very different approaches. And really, if you feel good upon completion of what you've committed to and I feel good upon completion of what I've committed to, then that to me indicates, well, then this is something that you should continue to do because it's of service and you're getting real time feedback that it's working.

Exactly. It's like, how does it feel in the body? And if and if something

is not helping to to contribute to my regularity, to my ability to feel grounded, then that's my signal. So when I was going through that kind of phase of or chaotic, you know, morning practices, I was listening to my body because I wasn't feeling stable in my body with rigor. I was feeling suffocated. I was feeling anxious. I was feeling like I needed to, like, break out and get get away.

Yeah. And so now that is the opposite. That's what I'm actually craving. So it really is about how does it feel in the body? And that signal that I feel stable, I feel consistent, I feel grounded, just a great indicator as we start to explore like, okay, like, what do I start to trust outside of me?

Do I trust people? Do I trust environments? Do I trust situations, processes, institutions? And so let's start talking about the external little bit. The second question that you brought into circle was in what or whom do you struggle to trust?

And what is it about that person or situation that makes it challenging to trust them? And so I'd be curious, to know a little bit about about your perspective on this.

Well, it was just a a counterpoint to the first question, recognizing when I don't trust something, what's really happening. Because it's especially when we think about other people, it's easy sometimes to say, oh, they they're not they're not saying it the way that I would say it or doing it the way that I would do it, and that's hard for me to trust. But in reality, there's, to me at least, a deeper level that we could look at, which would be, oh, I'm fearful per perhaps. I'm fearful that I'm gonna lose something. And then that's informing so, again, going back to when you don't trust someone or something, maybe it's a job, maybe it's an organization, Like, looking inward, well, how is it that making me feel?

Right? And then from that place, what can I do with that information?

The things that got that got brought up during Circle was kind of this, like, I can still recognize that I might not trust something, but I'm still going to do it or I'm still going to engage with it. I'm still going to participate in that person or that thing because of what I heard you say was like sometimes a fear, a fear of losing something can take over. And if that fear is greater than my own personal trust, then I might abandon myself and go forward and quote unquote trust that person thing or place.

Yeah. Say that again. I wanna make sure I understand you.

Mhmm. So the situation is that, like, I am seeing somebody, dating somebody. Okay. And I have that that feeling inside of me. This person is showing up in a in a way either inconsistent or consistently inconsistent, and I I'm feeling a little icky around them.

However, my fear of losing them and my fear of, like, not having love is keeping me in that situation. Right? Yeah. And so why do we sometimes abandon our own inner knowing in favor of, quote unquote, trusting others?

Well, I think one form of mistrust that a lot of us have, I certainly have, is lack mentality. I don't trust that there's gonna be enough of almost everything. And so then I get I get really fearful about what it would look like without it. And, you know, I wanted to say this earlier, you know, this felt sense, will help us to connect to our inner wisdom and our intuition. And so the more we're aware of it, the more we can utilize it.

And so I think in that moment, we will often have this something deep in us is saying something about this isn't right. But if I'm if I'm not skilled at dealing for that, listening in a sensational way for it, then it won't be as obvious. And then the more subtle it is, the easier it is for us to be like, was that real? And then especially in the context of fear based thinking. So I'm getting this ping.

It's not very loud, though, because I don't really listen to the pings very much. But, you know, it's sort of telling me that this person feels a little off. But I don't know. And now I'm terrified that if I don't if if I don't hold on to this person, I'll never feel love ever again. Well, then boom.

Now I'm gonna I'm I'm gonna not trust my intuitive ping, and I'm gonna work in opposition to what I actually want. And so I think the process would then be, oh, my lack of trust here in this person is connected to my fear that I won't I won't ever be loved. So I I I'm willing to accept some weird contorted version of what looks like love, something in the slice of love, which is whatever this person might be giving us, because it's better to have that than to have nothing.

And in in that process, what I'm also hearing is kind of a deterioration of self trust. Because the more often that if I were to do that, and I've done that before in past relationships where I am going in and I'm like, I sense something, but I'm doing it anyway. And in doing that, I'm not upholding my own commitments to myself. And that was part of the opening here is that we build trust in ourselves, we build self confidence by upholding the commitments to ourselves. And if one of those commitments is like listening to myself and I'm not doing that over and over and over again, my self confidence is going to be in the basement.

It's going to be really hard to work through that. And so that's where the baby steps of like, okay, what commitments can I uphold for myself to build up a little bit of that confidence, to build up a little bit of that trust so that I can then listen, oh, I I don't trust this person, place, or thing? So now I can start to make more, like, self beneficial decisions.

I think when people hear about this and when I first heard about felt sense and trusting my internal wisdom and my and my gut instinct and all of that, if we if we jump too fast to, oh, I'm supposed to blindly trust these feelings, It's not really real. So if you're listening and you want to start this process, it doesn't mean that you have to act boldly on every sensation or ping that you get. Step one would simply become aware of when the pings exist and and how they feel for you. So I'm not saying you feel one ping and you decide to break up or get a divorce or leave your job. You know?

I'm saying if you're just starting, notice the ping and start to notice the pattern of the ping. You know, when we talked about purpose, we talked about joy as being the breadcrumbs on the in the direction of purpose. Right? The feeling of joy, the experience of joy being an indication that I'm moving in the right direction. Well, this the same is true here.

Start to notice the sensations in your physical body. Let that be the first step. And then if you are continually feeling uneasy, it's hard to trust this person, they're feeling mysterious, they're feeling inconsistent, whatever the thing is, then you can start by acting on a pattern. And then I suspect when you get really good at it, then you can start acting on one initial ping because you will have been practiced in recognizing it. But initially, notice everything you can and then and then act in the beginning on patterns that you've identified.

With this one person, I feel we've hung out seven times, and six of the seven times, I have felt uneasy in this way. Okay. Well, that's a that's a pattern. And it it's actually a fact. If it you know, oh, I I have felt uneasy six out of seven times.

That that was your experience. And you're like, well, what do wanna do about that? Do you wanna continue to be in situations where you feel uneasy? And that's so that's my advice for step one. Notice as much as you can in your physical body and then start to look for patterns.

I love that because it it really is aligned with a a current situation that's going on in my life right now, which is like this big shift that I'm making in my career and what it is that I actually want to be doing with this one precious life that I have. And so for all the listeners, I was laid off from my corporate job in December, and we're filming this in April. And so I've been working through a lot of things over the last couple of months. I've been interviewing for jobs remotely all over the country, in person, hybrid, all these things. And I've gone through the exploration of like, what is it that I want to do?

And I actually got to the finish line with a company in Boston that wanted me in the office three days a week. And as I was going through the interview process, it was really long and drawn out. I think I went through almost I think it was nine halls altogether. And I was like, this is starting to feel like a chore. And my level of interest and engagement in the company was like, it was still there, but there was something that started to creep in.

And so I could have. I could have, like, reacted on my first feeling, but I didn't. I, like, sat with it and I was like, is this a pattern? Am I consistently feeling something that is that is is my body saying, like, maybe this isn't the right decision? And I had to sit with it of like, am I making an impulsive decision to either go with this company or not go with this company?

And so I sat with it and sat with it. And there were several moments that I was like, I was feeling very strongly one way or the other. And then there were a couple universal signs, we'll call them, that started to pop in. And then we'll take this into our next topic of trusting external something bigger, greater. And that was I was thinking about the prospect of going back into the city versus another possibility, which was going into yoga teacher training.

And I was talking to my therapist about it, and he said, he was like, I wish I could show you a mirror right now because the bodily difference in you is significant. When you're talking about going back to the city, you're collapsing and you're so small. And then when you think about, oh, other things that you could be doing, leading guided meditations, teaching yoga classes, all these other things, you're lighting up and you're getting positive and you're getting big. And then I as I was leaving therapy, I went past the library. And in Provincetown, we have these things called little free libraries where people, like, donate books.

And I walked by it. It was the Yoga Sutras of Patanjali. And I was like, okay, universe. Like, now what are you saying? Ended up not taking the job in Boston, and I did enroll in yoga teacher training.

And it and it's not because I saw that book. It's because I saw that book in relation to a bunch of other signs that were pointing me towards joy, pointing me towards something that was I felt a little bit more trust in. Thank

you for sharing that story. I think it's important. I you know, you mentioned so looking at the looking at the pattern of felt sense in the body and then recognizing you know, so we've been talking about as a step one. I do think that there are moments and people capable of having one intuitive ping and making the right decision based on that ping. But the other thing I wanna talk about with regards to it is those people probably have a very practiced conversation with their own body and felt sense.

And so I They

know their hell yeses and hell nos pretty clearly.

Right. So there's something about the intensity of the feeling too. Right? So if a person who has a regular practice like this has a very strong moment of revolt, disgust, or something, and they've they're good at they have practiced that, then they can trust it right away. For those of us who are starting this process, it probably won't come so loudly, so quickly, so obviously.

Mine was not loud, quick, or I mean, this is a long process to, like, get to this point.

Right. Well and I think that's so in your story, you talked about having these sort of ebbing and flowing moments through the process and that it's good that you stuck with it and started looking for the pattern and not for the impulse because that's how you're gonna refine your capacity to feel bigger and fuller so that one day maybe it is one ping and you know. But so for anyone listening, that's that's the the version we've all seen in, like, TV shows and movies. Like, oh, I'm a psychic, and I just get this flash, and then I immediately know. And I think that's possible in the same way that other incredible things are possible, but I think the people who can do that have practiced.

So practice is all I'm saying. Yeah. Practice listening to your physical body

and trusting that that will lead you to something that is is meant for you or something that will benefit you in some way. And so, yeah, I want to transition or use this as an opportunity to move into trusting of, let's call it a higher power or just something greater than ourselves. Because in my example, my story, like, I could look at the the yoga book in the little free library as like a sign from the universe. Yeah. And, like, do I trust things like that?

Do I trust signs from the universe? And for me, for a long time, I did not. I was like, nope. Don't believe in it. Don't.

Like, that is not that sort of woo woo is not for me. Right? I don't trust that type of thinking. And now I'm learning to be like, oh, these are just signs. It's not an impulse.

I don't need to say like, oh, I saw I saw the yoga sutras and now I have to change my entire life path because I saw that at that one time. But it was like, oh, I'm trusting in this whole process and now I'm seeing a sign. Now can I trust that there is a bigger plan for me? Then

I think a few things. The first thing that comes to mind is that Juna principle of the world is what we think it is. So if you you just said, you know, there was a time when you didn't you didn't believe in that, so then signs didn't exist for you, and that was your truth. And now you are saying that your thinking has shifted. Okay.

So now things are different. I also think there's this energy flows where attention goes is another Huna principle. But yeah. And so you've been now steeped more in men's work, shamanic embodiment, yogic prac you know? So when you tell that story about the Yoga Sutras, part of me wonders, well, that that book could have been there many other times, but you didn't have yoga on the heart and brain.

And now you have yoga on the heart and brain, so now you start seeing a thing that you might have otherwise not seen. It's interesting when I had my shoulder surgery, this was in 02/2009. And so I was I was in an arm sling and had this little orange ball. And once, like, I had that, I started looking around the world, and I saw so many other people with orthopedic things, slings, canes, casts, boots, you know, all the I was like, where where did all this stuff come from? I was living in New York City at the time.

And then I thought, oh, it's probably been here the whole time, but it hasn't been in my the forefront of my mind or in my consciousness, so I just sort of didn't see it. So this is why, being mindful of what we're thinking and what we're intaking is so important because, we're likely gonna find more of it. So if you are looking for reasons for the world to not have enough, you'll find it. And if you are looking for reasons for the world to have enough, well, then you'll find that too. And, you know, we could approach this from different perspectives, but there's a lot of spiritual teachings that have the same teaching from different traditions.

But they're also our nervous system and how it works. So so it is a real practice. Look for the things you wanna see. And then and so then on some level, when you see them, well, is it a sign? It's a sign that you are directing your focus.

Now are you directing it consciously? That's the question.

Are you consistent in that? And like, So I love the reflection of, yes, I had embodiment on the heart and the mind. And so the universe may have had all these little sprinklings around me, but I wasn't looking for them. Or I wasn't open to them, receptive to them. And now it's like, oh, that that the possibility that that could be something that I could that I could be on the lookout for is now more apparent.

You know, I I don't know if I've told this story on the on the podcast before, but many of you already know that I was an acupuncturist. And I worked as an acupuncturist in New York City for many years until I studied acupuncture in Chinese medicine. And when I first started studying Chinese medicine, it felt fake to me. And I I got into acupuncture in a from a very orthopedic perspective because I was getting it while I was dancing professionally. And so I was interested in biomechanics and and muscle tissues and connections and that kind of thing.

So you start learning about, Chinese medicine, you're like, oh, well, like, there's dampness and there's phlegm and then there's heat and there's all you know? And I'm like I'm like, this is all like, what is what are you talking about? Right? I didn't have a thing for it. And then through the practice, it started to reveal itself to me.

And I was like, oh, these patterns and presentations that the Chinese had been observing for thousands of years. And so then I started looking for it. I'm like, oh, I'm looking for these imbalances, and then you start to see them. And it's it's kind of amazing. You have to be willing to look.

So if you make a choice to say, don't believe something, that's fine. But then be mindful of making that choice because it can sort of shut you off to the possibility that there are other things.

I love that example because it highlights an evolution of trust. Oh, I don't trust this practice or this process because it doesn't make sense to me. There's not enough backing behind it, or I don't understand the evidence behind it. And then it's like, oh, but bit by bit, I'm starting to see more and more of how this could be a useful thing, how this is a beneficial thing. And then I'm starting to see the beauty of it, and I trust it more and more.

Yeah. And I think that that for me has been work that I've been doing around something bigger than myself. Is like that growing up, I was like, nope, not for me. Right? Like, I don't trust it.

I don't believe in it. I don't like, none of that. And then it's like starting to become a little bit more open, a bit more receptive, a little bit more like curious about it. I'm like, oh, okay. Maybe I can trust that.

There's this thing called the universe that has my best interest at heart. Like, oh, okay. Starts to make a little bit more sense. Start to, like, trust that a little bit more. So, like, acupuncture is also something that's not a person or a place, like a thing.

Yeah. It's like, yeah. And I can I, like, go into it with a little skepticism, but then, like, learn to trust it a little bit?

Be willing to to have an experience of it. And this is why, you know, we come back to the power of embodiment. This acupuncture story that I was telling is is helpful because when you started when you would get treatments and start to feel things moving, it was that was the moment when I'm like, oh, wait. I see what you mean. I see what you mean when you said there was cold there.

There was cold damp there. There was, you know, there was phlegm there. There was, you know, dryness. You know? I I I start to see what you mean because I I am feeling what you mean.

I'm feeling it in me. Experiencing your feelings. I'm having an embodied experience of the medicine that is then saying, oh, that's what that is. Then what? Right?

And and so it it really opened it up, and it was the body that helped me to do it. Because otherwise, this all just sounds sort of like poetic kind of like And especially in Western culture, like, if you don't show me

the hard facts, like, I don't believe in. I don't trust it. Yeah. I mean Like, where's where's the science? Where's the where like, show me that.

Sometimes that that doesn't exist. You have to feel it in the body to experience it yourself to be like, oh, okay. Like, I can trust this because I now know what they're talking about.

Yeah. For example, like, they say something like an invasion of wind. Imagine imagine being like a super western orthopedic, you know, and I'm like, what? What? I'm like, I wanna I wanna treat tendonitis or or trigger points or, you know, that sort of thing.

I'm like, what are you talking about wind? Until you experience wind in your body, and then you're like, oh, that's what they mean by wind, and that's what the Chinese had been observing for thousands of years over, you know, millions of people. Because the one thing I will say, like, my my infomercial about acupuncture is that, you know, it doesn't really fits fit itself well into the current Western medical research. It's hard to isolate a a mechanism when with a needle because it can be so many things simultaneously. Right?

But people don't typically do things for thousands of years that don't work. The idea that, oh, well, this medicine and acupuncture has been practiced for thousands of years. Well, you know, how many things do you do that you don't get a benefit from? I would argue most of us try to avoid those things at all cost. But when we recognize something doesn't give us any value, we often stop doing that.

Right? And so, yeah, I'm like, there's been an entire, like, gigantic country of people who've been doing this for a long time. There's gotta be something to it. And then when you have the when you have the experience of it in your own body, you're like, well, now I'm sold. I get it because I've experienced it.

And I think the same thing from my own experience with anything spirituality based. Like, I for the longest time was like, nope. Don't want anything to do with it. And now it's like, oh, well, if many people have a spiritual practice and can start to, like, believe in something greater than themselves, like, oh, I can too.

Well, believing in something greater than ourselves. So elite like believing in magic. So when I was in my yoga teacher training, you know, my one of my teachers, Sharon Gannon, she would she basically introduced me to the idea that every word we said, we were casting spells. Right? And initially, when you hear that, you're like, what?

You know? But then you see all this research in that that water study that we that we talked about, and you're like, oh, the words that I say and that I think actually do have an impact, and especially the words that I can continue to say over and over and over. So if I'm constantly berating myself for being you know? And we have all this negative self talk. I don't even wanna say it now because we're talking about, like you know?

But, like, it's it's not hard for people to think of examples where they think about an aspect of themselves that they don't like, and they kind of repeat that and beat themselves up. And I believe now there is an impact, a physiological impact that happened. And so if you change your words, you can't just and the so back to the consistency, you can't just change them once. Although even once is better than nothing, I assume. But you'd have to you'd have to practice it to to make it happen.

But we know now. It's like, oh, so magic does exist. Is it a powder in, like, a, like, a velvety bag? Well, maybe not. But is it conscious language?

Maybe.

If you do it enough times over and over again, go back to consistency. Mhmm. Consistently, if I'm doing something and even if it is that that powder in that velvet bag, if I'm consistently doing that and I'm seeing a positive change or shift in my life or I'm feeling even better yet, if I'm feeling a positive shift, yeah, I trust that. I trust that thing.

Well, so Sharon Gannon said, Through repetition, the magic arises, and it's that. So practice these things. And now in yoga, we're practicing conscious breath, conscious movement, uplifted intentions, ethical considerations, and whatnot. And the more you practice something, the more you will see it. Speaking of practicing, I do want to talk about breath.

Oh, I love breath. Yes.

Because I've not always enjoyed breath or breath work practices. Breath was one of those things that I had a mistrust of. Okay. Felt a lot of, like, lack of safety with my own breath. Like, remember as a kid, like, when I first learned that I could control my breath, I don't think for two decades I didn't take an unconscious breath.

I was always trying to control my breath. I was obsessive about breathing in, breathing out, breathing in, breathing out. And so when I went into my first breath work practice, I was like my nervous system was like, nope, not for me. Absolutely not. Can't do this.

And it wasn't until I was like I started to feel like be able to rest in it, to feel a little safe in it that I was like, oh, okay. I can do Ujjayi breath in yoga very loudly, very proudly. But that wasn't always the case. Like, linking breath to movement was a very foreign concept for me and actually did not make me feel safe. Right?

Because I was like, it was it would just send me

to a tizzy. So it was You're very overwhelmed.

Overwhelmed. Yeah. It would it would overwhelm me. I was like, I could do one thing. Yeah.

Right? Like, let me just move my leg. Yeah. Right? And so the last thing that I wanna cover with that I'm sorry, y'all.

I'm feeling a little rambly scrambly today, and we're just going with it.

Let's just go with it. Rambly scrambly. Rambly scrambly. Scrambled eggs sound delicious. Oh.

Yeah. Don't get no. No. No. No.

You're like like I'm

like trusting my gut right now. I'm like scrambled eggs for dinner sounds great. Okay. So stay on stay on topic. So the last thing that I wanted to cover was an interesting thing that came up for me in embodiment practice on Tuesday around breath.

We went through several breath work practices facilitated by Tim,

and they were very masterfully And

gave me a lot of opportunities to work with trusting myself, trusting others, trusting containers, trusting the safety of an environment. So in some of the breath work practices, I was like, oh, I can do this on my rhythm, on my time. I'm feeling really good. I'm feeling really powerful. I'm feeling really in control.

And then there were moments where I was like, oh, now we're introducing you introduced the metronome. And you're like, okay. Like, now I'm gonna keep the rhythm with this metronome and, like, and you trust that timing. Can I trust you to keep the timing? Can I trust you to know?

Like, I think what what happened was, like, I didn't feel a full safety of like, oh, you don't know what's inside of my body. Right? Like, I don't feel safe doing this this this count this way. And then I had to sit with it and be like, oh, like, what can I? Can I trust?

Do I have enough consistency of what's happened in life to be like, okay, I can do this? And so it just gave me an opportunity to really work with a lot of trust. And then when you took away the metronome and the counting, it was then like, oh, can I then trust all the men in this space to keep count? And then also maybe that's not the count that I want. So it's like, can I yeah?

Anyway, so a lot a lot came up.

Yeah. Yeah. So for for context, anyone listening, we were doing a something called a V Samavritti Pranayama. It's where the the it was a box breath, essentially. Inhaling, holding at the top, exhaling, and holding at the bottom.

But instead of it being equal, four counts in, four count hold, four counts out, four count hold, it was unequal, and there was a ratio. So we did a two count inhale, held the breath at the top for eight counts. We did a four count exhale, and then we held the breath out at the bottom for six counts. And my experience of that practice, this is a a ratio that I had been given from my teachers at Jeeva Mukti, is that it pushes me to my edge, especially if you do it for long enough. And you get to start to feel what what comes up.

And so it's a way especially when we're in a practice space, a great way of understanding, well, what does what does it start to feel like when I'm approaching my edge? What does it then feel like when I'm at my edge? When does it what does it start to feel like when I'm about to push past my edge? And just getting comfortable with those feelings because, you know, the that that ratio sometimes makes me feel a little panicky. When you start to feel like you're out

of breath, you're like you know? And then Well, the thing is that, like, if I'm doing it to my ratio and to my count, I love that ratio. And I could do it for an hour and have no problem because it's my ratio. My four is gonna be different than your four. It's gonna be different than another brother's four.

Sure. Right? And for for me, like, I am a I'm a slower, deeper inhaler, exhaler, and that's comfortable for me. So my four might be +1, 234. Somebody else's is +1, 234.

Yeah. Right? Yeah. And that's what I'm talking about. That's where I'm like, oh, can I like, I can trust my count because I know that it feels good for me Yeah?

And it feels right for me. Now I have to trust somebody else's count, and I don't like the way that that feels in my body. Yeah.

And you get well, you get to learn. And the good news is you got to have you can have both experiences.

I got to have both.

You had you had one in the in the circle. Now you can go home and do that same practice on your own count. Right? But you also then learned, well, what does it feel like when I'm when I'm being asked to meet a different tempo? A different kind of edge.

And, like, what what does that feel like? And how can I be conscious around that without collapsing? Because that same thing for sure pops up in your life. Definitely. And, you know, and it's not always gonna be a physical practice where it pops up.

It could pop up when you're having a tough conversation with a friend or making a tough decision with regards to your career. And, you know, and you're like, oh, I I I know what it feels like to get uncomfortable. And can I be uncomfortable without collapsing? I think this is when, you know, when people can without this awareness, people can then make unskillful choices or engage in unhelpful behaviors, and then that will erode their trust in themselves. When I get really angry and when I'm without awareness of how that feels and what to do, I then start making bad choices I later regret.

And now I can't trust myself because I'm the person who gets irrationally angry. You know? It's like so these practices are designed to help you understand. This is what it feels like when you're getting when you're 10 feet away from your edge. No.

This is what it feels like when you're five feet away from your edge. This is what it feels like when you're right at your edge. And in these practices, sometimes you you get pushed past your edge. Well, this is what that feels like too. Now without awareness, I can be more skillful when I inevitably am am brought to my edge because person x on the sidewalk did a thing.

And it also helps me at least to understand, like, what might be the root there of, like, what is bringing me to my edge? And in the breath work example, it's like, oh, there's a little bit of mistrust of authority. And control. And control. And so that becomes my practice.

It's like, oh, I've hit an edge. What's underneath that? Oh, somebody else is telling me the breath count. Right? Like, so now I'm prickly.

Right. I wanna go back now to acupuncture because this happened a lot where when I would have first time patients, I would explain, like, the process. But sometimes people would have a really tough time accepting the treatment and not not for the reason we all think right now, which is like, oh, it's sharp. Sharpness isn't a thing that happens a lot in acupuncture. You know, it hasn't been in my experience.

It can be sharp occasionally, but most of the time not. What people struggle with is all the other sensations that can come up a heavy, an achy, a spreading, a warming, a vibrating, a trickling, like, all that sort of stuff can come up. And people who struggle with relinquishing control don't like that a sensation is coming up that I can't control. And so very frequently, I would I would say, well, you know, what is your relationship with control? Because it would legitimately be freaking them out.

And it was an opportunity for them to start to work with, can I can I engage with a medicine that is going that part of that is gonna be sensational? And can I get comfortable with feeling a sensation that I can't control? I just had a big moment with that. It's like going back to, like, as a kid, like, controlling my breath. It was something I could control, something I could feel safe with.

And now old patterning that comes up when I'm in a facilitated breath work is like, oh, you're taking away my security blanket. Because for the longest time, me controlling my breath was what kept me safe, what kept me calm.

So this is a great this is a great thing because, like, the the work here has less to do with the breath practice and everything to do with your awareness of control. And why? Because there is gonna be a moment in your life where you are not gonna be in control, whether you're not gonna be in full control or there's gonna be a moment where you don't have the amount of control that you want, which is maybe some or none at all. And so why are these practices in in this exploration valuable? Well, because what are your choices then?

Well, you could you could never practice. You could never prepare yourself for that moment, and then you could be thrust into it and act unskillfully, or you can consciously put yourself in these moments where you start to understand how it is so that when you inevitably find yourself there, it is an unchartered territory. You've been there before. You have some sense. Trust.

You have you can trust yourself enough to know these are my edges. These are the resources I need to start to pull in. These are the questions I need to start asking. These are I maybe I like, now I know I need to take some space. Now I need now I know I need to call this person.

Now I you know, you have some things. If you don't ever look or practice this, it's a it's a roll of the dice. I hope it goes well.

Yeah. Mhmm.

No. Truly. And it often doesn't go well. So I think when people are like, oh, so why do we do a breath work practice where you start to feel a little panicky so that you can understand what it feels like to get really panicky and see how what your tendency is in that moment. And then start making choices around is that the tendency that serves you?

Well, if not, can you practice something else? What would that be?

It's helping me surrender. Right? And like the concept of like, what is it that I can't control? And the truth is a shit ton. There's so much in this world that I cannot control.

But I can make the conscious choice to surrender. I can make the conscious choice to, like, rest in the free fall and, like, trust the process, trust life, Trust my body. Yeah. Trust that, like, I've got everything that I need to figure out this complicated roller coaster that is life if I step back and I stop trying to control just a little bit.

And if you get comfortable with with if you get comfortable with understanding what it means to be in a situation where you either have limited or no control. So I'm gonna I kinda wanna wrap up with this, which is I think I talked about it here that time on retreat with the sweat lodge. Yes. Right? And so, recently, on a different retreat, Amir was talking about potentially doing that again.

And I'm very excited to try it again because now that I understand what's coming, it's gonna be an opportunity for me to practice. I know when I get there and I have this opportunity, I'm going to be nervous and I'm gonna be uncomfortable, and I'm, you know, and I'm gonna make some choices that will hopefully let me do it. But then the value for me isn't so much in the detoxification of the sweat, but in the in the being able to put myself in a place that where I'm uncomfortable and with a limited amount of control and practice being in that place so that the next time when it happens in real life, I will have a greater sense of how how I show up in those moments and then what I might need. That's the power of this work. So it's all about how do we show up?

Well, if I have no context, you know, if I only ever practice feeling really good, then when you inevitably don't feel really good, you're you're not gonna have been you're not prepared for that. What are you gonna do? And usually, it's collapse or or behave unskillfully. So that's why we do these practices. That's why it's so important.

Okay. I got really passionate. Thank you for listening to that.

A lot because it's like you're building you've built so much more trust in yourself and the capacity of, like, being in a situation that could arise and, like, knowing so much more about yourself and knowing so much more about the process and who you're with. You're trusting yourself. You're trusting the the leadership. You're trusting the the the the thing. Right?

Like

Well, you know, Amir talks about putting in the reps when it comes to group facilitation and body facilitation yoga. And, you know, every time I started doing something new, teaching dance, teaching yoga, teaching embodiment, I would get so nervous. I would get so, so nervous. And a lot of that was fear. Like, if I don't do it perfectly, no one's gonna love me.

They're not gonna have me back. I'm not gonna make enough money. Blah blah blah blah blah. And now I through practice and through experiencing those nerves, I have come to trust myself in a way that is so much more easeful. And therefore, I think of much greater service.

So now when I get up in front of the room, I don't have the same amount of nerves. Even if I am having some nerves, I don't have these debilitating, like, all encompassing nerves. And then I think I offer something better. It's actually it's more comfortable. It's more mutually beneficial.

Yeah. But it's that trust. I was through practice, I now know I trust myself to be able to deliver a practice that is of value and to be able to improv in that practice if I need to. Your abilities, trust in what's gonna come through, gonna be more authentic, gonna be more you. But there's like the putting in the reps is what?

Consistency. So when when there is consistency, there is greater trust.

Trust the process. Y'all just continuously show up for yourselves. I'm just proud of myself. I hope that when you get to this point in the podcast, see that today was a scrambly, rambly day for me. And I'm just trusting the process.

I'm putting in the reps. And this is this is it, y'all. Not yeah. Like, I don't even know how to close this. See?

See? Yeah. Scrambling rolling. But it's okay.

It's okay. Do you feel complete?

And so I wanted to ask as a closing of this practice, maybe we could do a couple rounds of the one four two three next breath.

If you're if you're listening or watching at home, we'll we'll do two rounds of it. The one four two three is the ratio. But in the practice, we did we doubled it. So it's you know? Well, just count us.

The one inhale is pretty fast.

Yeah.

So we're gonna inhale for two, hold at the top for eight, exhale for four, hold at the bottom for six. So let's take a deep inhale. And an exhale for three two. And ready. Here we go.

Inhale 21. Holding 87654321. Exhaling 432. Holding out for 665432. 1.

Inhale. Two one. Hold in. Eight seven six five four three two one. Exhale.

Four three two one. Hold out. 654321. Release the practice. Let the breath be natural and unaffected.

I promise you if you practice that breath technique and when I practice it, I usually do a four sixteen eight twelve. Yep. By round five or six, you're having an experience. And then be grateful and you know, with that experience and what it has to teach you.

Because I'm already feeling a a big shift and, yeah, a little more stable. So consistency in practice and trusting somebody else. Yeah. So thank you.

So with that, I feel complete. And I feel complete too. Let's close our eyes and draw our spine tall. Take a deep inhale through the nose. Gentle sigh through the mouth.

And it is with deep appreciation and gratitude for the shared sacred space, for any insights, awarenesses, or understandings that may have come that we now release the archetypes and the spirits that we called in to hold sacred space for us. And with these words, our container is open but not broken. Uh-huh.